Okay there I just used every swear word imaginable .I actully wasted 15 minutes of my life arguing volume metric efficiency on a god damn ls engine ,jesus can I buy my time back . short story is this my buddy is finishing a 1989 civic ef RHD with 300 HP /1.8 liter toda race engine with itb's . We are talking about this at the store when somebody overhears us , & proceeds to argue with us telling us that were wasting our time and that is stupid to do . Then he seriously has the balls to tell us to put a frikin corvette engine in a civic . Lol. that's when dudes about to throw punches cuz I told him to grow up pushrod dinosaur ..lololol.
drake
Lol, you gotta pick your battles man. One bit of wisdom I've learned in my short life is don't argue with idiots, all you will do is raise your blood pressure. I've got to the point now where if someone makes a statement that I don't agree with, is blatantly wrong, or is just plain offensive I just let it slide. I will debate a point or topic with close friends or co-workers because I respect them, and I do care what they think. As for strangers or people I don't respect, its not worth my time to get a point across because I just don't care what they think.
IF you're going to put a corvette motor in a civic, at least have the decency to put a few turbos on it. I mean, really.
I am sick and goddamn tired of ****ing LS engines. Why doesn't everyone stop cheaping out and get a real V8?
"LS this, LS that, hey everyone, let's have a circlejerk around this bathtub on wheels! Yeah!" Meanwhile, the Coyote is quietly turning 8,000rpm and the DOHC supercharged 5.4 is not-as-quietly making 800+ HP over on the other side of the room. Just like the 2nd-gen small block, the LS is cheap and easy. The block is inches-thick because GM couldn't design a block that was any smaller that could still support any sort of power. That is exactly where the benefits end. Put a real V8 in a car, such as a 5.4 and enjoy making 1,500HP+ on an engine that's stock from the heads down...
It also doesn't sound like someone put a German Shepherd with laryngitis at the end of a long, empty hallway and poked it in the ass with a red-hot fire poker.
"LS this, LS that, hey everyone, let's have a circlejerk around this bathtub on wheels! Yeah!" Meanwhile, the Coyote is quietly turning 8,000rpm and the DOHC supercharged 5.4 is not-as-quietly making 800+ HP over on the other side of the room. Just like the 2nd-gen small block, the LS is cheap and easy. The block is inches-thick because GM couldn't design a block that was any smaller that could still support any sort of power. That is exactly where the benefits end. Put a real V8 in a car, such as a 5.4 and enjoy making 1,500HP+ on an engine that's stock from the heads down...
It also doesn't sound like someone put a German Shepherd with laryngitis at the end of a long, empty hallway and poked it in the ass with a red-hot fire poker.
I know why it's used... But a Ford is a better engine, in my opinion. It may not have 17 moving parts, ring tolerances you could drive a truck through, and heads you could toss together with a blindfold, some hand tools, and a spark plug gapper; but it's a better engine. When people say the LS is better than the mod motor, I equate it to someone saying a Super Beetle is better than a 959 just because it's simpler and cheaper.
That guy got me pissed . Woke up this morning thinking about it .Usually suk it up. But last night, long day. Lol. The whole point is its ours, our time , our money, our project who f****** cares except us . Right? the thought of a boring ass LS engine makes me wanna puke . Circle jerk thing was funny though ..lololololol
Okay... my .02 for what it's worth.
I don't care if you like the LSx engines. Just stop and take a look at what GM has DONE with those old dinosaur pushrod engines. And really, the old addage of "If it's not broke, don't fix it" applies here.
Do I like my mod 4.6? Yes I do. Do I think multi-valve engines are the way to go? Well... Maybe. Everytime I think so, I have to stop and look what GM has and is doing.
I don't care if you like the LSx engines. Just stop and take a look at what GM has DONE with those old dinosaur pushrod engines. And really, the old addage of "If it's not broke, don't fix it" applies here.
Do I like my mod 4.6? Yes I do. Do I think multi-valve engines are the way to go? Well... Maybe. Everytime I think so, I have to stop and look what GM has and is doing.
Yes, they've done some cool things, but in my opinion, none of it involves engineering that is on par with Ford's powerplants. It seems like every time GM makes a big leap forward with the LS, Ford just steps it up one tiny notch and blows the LS away. It's not the lack of valves that bothers me about the LS (you'll never find a bigger fan of the 302 or even the Y-block than the guy writing this post), it's that fact that just like any other GM powerplant, it seems to be put together with hopes, dreams, and extremely thick oil. Sure, the LS seems to be a relatively reliable base, but feel how it runs compared to a Ford. The same can be said about 4-cylinders.
The Quad-4 in my buddy's Z24 makes about as much power as my D23, but it does so at the cost of more displacement and the convincing idea that the bottom end is made out of hollow iron castings filled with paperweights. It's sluggish to rev, abrasive to drive, downright loud in all the wrong ways, and barely revs beyond 5K. You may say that the Quad-4 is old, old technology, and I wouldn't argue that if you paid me, but when you really look at it, the LS is even older in it's lineage. It's time for GM to step up and build something worthwhile. I'm sick of cheap and easy coming from GM.
The Quad-4 in my buddy's Z24 makes about as much power as my D23, but it does so at the cost of more displacement and the convincing idea that the bottom end is made out of hollow iron castings filled with paperweights. It's sluggish to rev, abrasive to drive, downright loud in all the wrong ways, and barely revs beyond 5K. You may say that the Quad-4 is old, old technology, and I wouldn't argue that if you paid me, but when you really look at it, the LS is even older in it's lineage. It's time for GM to step up and build something worthwhile. I'm sick of cheap and easy coming from GM.
Back up 50 years, or fast-forward 50, 100, howevermany years... and (supposed) car guys will always be having the same damn argument.
WHO CARES?
Build what you like, and shut up about the next guy's build.
You wanna build a Ford motor. Fork over the bucks and BUILD IT!
If your neighbor wants to build an "old tech" LSx motor for half as much money... WHO CARES!!!! It's his frickin project!
You can go on about how awesomely smooth your motor runs, and he'll go on about how his is just as fast for half the money... and you'll go around and around and around and around... while you pound your cheap american beer, and either enjoy the hell out of it, or want to get pissy and throw down. :lol:
IMO... if an engine accomplishes what the owner wants it to... and he's happy with it.... AWESOME... and STFU!
REAL car guys appreciate cars. Not brands. Not specific technology. Not numbers of valves. Not coils or leaf springs.
FREAKIN CARS RULE!
/rant
Now, back to my delicious cup of SLO roasted coffee, with a bit of 2% milk and a single packet of Splenda™
WHO CARES?
Build what you like, and shut up about the next guy's build.
You wanna build a Ford motor. Fork over the bucks and BUILD IT!
If your neighbor wants to build an "old tech" LSx motor for half as much money... WHO CARES!!!! It's his frickin project!
You can go on about how awesomely smooth your motor runs, and he'll go on about how his is just as fast for half the money... and you'll go around and around and around and around... while you pound your cheap american beer, and either enjoy the hell out of it, or want to get pissy and throw down. :lol:
IMO... if an engine accomplishes what the owner wants it to... and he's happy with it.... AWESOME... and STFU!
REAL car guys appreciate cars. Not brands. Not specific technology. Not numbers of valves. Not coils or leaf springs.
FREAKIN CARS RULE!
/rant
Now, back to my delicious cup of SLO roasted coffee, with a bit of 2% milk and a single packet of Splenda™
On a minor note, that's "volumetric", not "volume metric".
My latest car purchase has pushrods, leaf springs, carburetor, and a stick axle. I love the hell out of it anyway.
My perfect garage would have (at minimum):
One crazy-output turbo four-banger with a loud BOV and all sorts of spooling goodness.
One supercharged ultra-whiney four with a great exhaust
One rev-to-the-moon four-banger on ITBs
One monster-cube V8 with a lopey-ass idle.
One small displacement V8 with a high redline
One screaming I6 with minimal muffling.
One angry flat-6 with the air-cooled clatter.
They're all awesome. I want to collect them all like Pokemon.
My latest car purchase has pushrods, leaf springs, carburetor, and a stick axle. I love the hell out of it anyway.
My perfect garage would have (at minimum):
One crazy-output turbo four-banger with a loud BOV and all sorts of spooling goodness.
One supercharged ultra-whiney four with a great exhaust
One rev-to-the-moon four-banger on ITBs
One monster-cube V8 with a lopey-ass idle.
One small displacement V8 with a high redline
One screaming I6 with minimal muffling.
One angry flat-6 with the air-cooled clatter.
They're all awesome. I want to collect them all like Pokemon.
Well, that's why I used "at minimum".
...but having driven a few automotive diesels, I don't feel they offer as much of the all around experience I look for in a fun car, which includes good noises and some top-end power.
As a daily driver, I'd LOVE a modern auto diesel, though my experience is limited to GM products. (Vectra CTDi auto, and a Zafira CTDi manual).
From an open-minded perspective though... hell yeah I'd add a diesel to the list, but it wouldn't be stock!
...but having driven a few automotive diesels, I don't feel they offer as much of the all around experience I look for in a fun car, which includes good noises and some top-end power.
As a daily driver, I'd LOVE a modern auto diesel, though my experience is limited to GM products. (Vectra CTDi auto, and a Zafira CTDi manual).
From an open-minded perspective though... hell yeah I'd add a diesel to the list, but it wouldn't be stock!
My only problem with the LS motor is that hey end up in the wrong cars. Japanese should stay Japanese, American should stay American, and European should stay European. Every car should have a motor that fits the personality of the car, there is not a Japanese car on earth that sounds right with an LS. On that note, my perfect swap would be a built, high reving 5.6 Nissan Titan motor in an s13 240sx, that's the right personality.
I'm sick of being accused of not being a car guy simply because I don't like certain cars or engines. I seldom meet a person with tastes as wide as my own. Unfortunately, the few things I don't like happen to be popular for reasons I find bogus.
/rant.
/rant.
I dunno Ryan, I've seen some pretty hot Japanese/American women in my life.
OH, you're talking CARS. :lol:
OH, you're talking CARS. :lol:
LS motors have their purpose; lightweight, powerful and proven. You just always know it will work. Thats why I'm sick of them as well. I don't have a problem with the motor, just the application. Its like hitting the easy button. When you want to do a build with a lot of power and don't want to fork out skill and creativity, you drop in an LS.
Now that the motor build has had all of 60 seconds of thought, lets move on to paint, wheels and slap her on the dyno because big numbers are the goal.
Now that the motor build has had all of 60 seconds of thought, lets move on to paint, wheels and slap her on the dyno because big numbers are the goal.
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