[ZX3Rally]

Hi all,

I only come on here every once and awhile these days, last time was in April i belive. I have made some fairly intreasting observations of focus owners over the past few years.

My first observation is that 8 out of 10 Foci could burst in to flame when you start it, and people here would still defend the Focus, and would still make completely outragous claims like "the Zetec is the best stock motor ever!".

Secondly, about a year ago, if someone complained about quality, or reliability, they would get flamed until they resembled bacon. People would say "It is just your car, not all foci have reliability problems", or "Overall quality of the focus is on the same level as VW..." and so on and so forth.

Now however the fact that the focus is no more reliable, has no better build quality, and has no better resale than the escort is generally accepted. Yet still still defned the little Focus, and amazingly, some still think that the focus is fast.

My question is this. The Focus is a slow car, there is no denying that, in addition it is no longer a value for the money. (02 WRX is cheaper than new SVT Focus!) It's only hope to continue to sell in the numbers it has been is as a stripped down econo box. It can not compete with the new GTi, or the SRT-4, etc. etc. Yet this is met with resistence here. why? That is what the focus is right? an econo box?

My 01 Focus 5 spd now has 30k mi, it has had two transmissions, 3 altnators, 2 starter motors, 4 sets of front brakes, and it is still slow as hell, despite the bolt on's. My focus is used a daily driver. I drive it all over Dallas while conducting bussiness, and even in this simple role, the Focus fails to be enjoyable, or reliable enough. So why all the defenders? I hate my focus, despise it in fact. I was dumb enough to buy something american made. I thought the focus would be diffrent, but I was wrong. This is by far the worst car I have EVER owned (and I've owned a lot of cars). It is a complete piece of [censored]. however now it is paid for, and worth almost nothing in resale, I am stuck with it for awhile.... at least I have my Surpa.

Ron

 

[ZXmurph]

I'm at a loss of what sort of posts you've read, but as an example I've been here for about two and a half years.
I bought a base focus, because upon testing everything in its price class thoroughly, I found it's driving dynamics of steering "feel", handling, and braking to completely set it apart from other budget cars. This opinion is shared by many, many people that aren't on this site and aren't focus "fans" by any means.

My ownership experience has been 100% trouble free, but that doesn't cause me to blast everyone that has had problems as "attacking" the Focus.. Additionally my car preparation has its performance easily eclipsing that of cars you mentioned in areas important to me.
My expectations of a cheap, yet very sound, tunable platform were met with the Focus.

I'm sorry your expectations weren't............but please don't let the blatant hyperbole of a few people who say "best stock motor ever" or some other misguided drivel allow you to generalize that this site is a bunch of biased automatons thinking this is the greatest car ever.

That is not the case.

Good luck with our next car........because often that is ALL it amounts to.

 

[panchocito]

My Focus is fast enough for me, it looks great, it hasn't caused a single problem for 20.000 miles, and anyway I'm covered for 55.000 more miles. And it can't be that bad if it was named the most reliable car in its class in Europe, the reliability gap between the Euro and U.S. Focus can't be that huge.

 

[ZX3Rally]

I always liked you Murph

I agree with you to some extent, and I'm glad your focus is better than mine.

You mentioned that your Focus would out perform some of the mentioned cars, I assume you mean a stock WRX, I do not beilive any focus could out perform a modified wRX, since they turn well over 300hp; though I could be wrong, since I am not a WRX owner.

No way on earth you can touch a Supra, even a stock TT would destroy all but the radiclly modified Foci. A BPU Supra would take them easily, drag, highway role, or most importanly, Road coarses, start talking about Single turbo Supra's and your in the 600-800 rwhp range, with 330 rubber on the back and 285 on the front.

 

[seminole_kev]

Focus = Affordable, fun, good-handling, general purpose car. I really like the Focus. Sure there would be a few things I'd change, but that would be true of any car. At its price brake, it really is the only option other than the Protege for a fun, daily driver.

I did have to get the fuel pump changed on my 2000 ZTS at 30K miles, which dissapoints me. Besides that though it has been fine as well as my 2002 ZX5 (right now approx 15K miles on the 2002 and 35K on the 2000).

 

[panchocito]

I always liked you Murph

I agree with you to some extent, and I'm glad your focus is better than mine.

You mentioned that your Focus would out perform some of the mentioned cars, I assume you mean a stock WRX, I do not beilive any focus could out perform a modified wRX, since they turn well over 300hp; though I could be wrong, since I am not a WRX owner.

No way on earth you can touch a Supra, even a stock TT would destroy all but the radiclly modified Foci. A BPU Supra would take them easily, drag, highway role, or most importanly, Road coarses, start talking about Single turbo Supra's and your in the 600-800 rwhp range, with 330 rubber on the back and 285 on the front.

Then why a ZX3????? Its obviously not what you need....

 

[ZX3Rally]

correct me if I'm wrong but when i as at the dealer the other day, there were many Focus' over 18k. On the same dealer's used car lot there was an 02 WRX with 18k mi on it for 18k even. There are lots of thing you can buy for under 18k that are fun, and a hellva lot more reliable than the focus, not to mention faster.

 

[blueSVT2911]

02 WRX is cheaper than new SVT Focus!

I bought my SVT last year for 14k BRAND NEW. You can't buy a USED wrx for that price. Not to mention I see a WRX on every street corner(literally, they are everywhere!), while I have yet to see another SVTF on the road. I don't care if my car isn't fast, it looks good, the interior is awesome, its fun to drive, and stock for stock it will beat a WRX at an auto-x. I don't just want a car that is fast in a straight line, I want a car that has all the qualities above, and for $14,000 this car met my expectations and delivered all of what I wanted. Oh, and maybe I got lucky, but my car has only been to the shop once, and it was for the RLA6 reflash which I requested

 

[ZX3Rally]

I addressed why I have a ZX3 in the original post. I auctually thought the Focus was going to be diffrent, a reliable, fun to drive encno box to put around town in, and as I stated before, I was wrong.

The Focus is no better than the escort.

 

[Ray]

No way on earth you can touch a Supra, even a stock TT would destroy all but the radiclly modified Foci. A BPU Supra would take them easily, drag, highway role, or most importanly, Road coarses, start talking about Single turbo Supra's and your in the 600-800 rwhp range, with 330 rubber on the back and 285 on the front.

i'd like to have a supra.
but the thing is, the focus is an economy car, and the supra isn't.

it's a fun economy car, but when i got it i wasn't thinking i was going to smoke 3 series bmw's or anything.

 

[ZX3Rally]

you got a great deal on that SVT, They are stickered at over 20k at my local ford dealer, used WRX's are 18k. I have seen stock WRX's take stock SVT's at the track, and at auto-x's. Unless that auto-x coarse is so tight the shorter wheel base comes into play, i don't find that likely.

 

[seminole_kev]

(slaps forhead). Well Jesus you're mixing new and used.

Hell I could get a 1995 BMW 750iL (The very recent, good looking body style) for less than a new fully loaded new ZTS, but that argument is silly. You could mix and match years, makes and models all you want that way. I think people are comparing new models to new models.

Part of the reason people buy new models is the safety net of a manufacturer's warranty. That is why the certified-pre owned market should continue to grow.

"Hey, I could have bought a used 92 Toyota Supra, but instead I bought two used 1989 Nissan 300ZX's instead. Awesome!

"

 

[P-51]

Wow, this is going to be an interesting thread.

I'm sorry you don't like your Focus, that it's been bad to you. However, many others like their cars, and for good reason.

I don't know where you get this idea that somebody said the Zetec is the best motor ever... Some of us have pointed out it is a *stout* motor when you take care of it properly. Many people running 250ish crank HP, and some have been up to 350 on stock internals. Pretty decent.

"Overall quality of the focus is on the same level as VW..." and so on and so forth.

Actually most Fords, the Focus included, consistently rate HIGHER than VW's.

My question is this. The Focus is a slow car, there is no denying that, in addition it is no longer a value for the money. (02 WRX is cheaper than new SVT Focus!) It's only hope to continue to sell in the numbers it has been is as a stripped down econo box. It can not compete with the new GTi, or the SRT-4, etc. etc. Yet this is met with resistence here. why? That is what the focus is right? an econo box?

The Focus is slow in stock form. A Focus RS is faster than a WRX, but we can't get that in the US. Fine, some of us understook to build our own, and have one-upped the RS.

My car currently is faster than a WRX on a road course in the rain.

The fact is, we didn't get a good motor, but the chassis and suspension are first rate. The engine we got is good enough to make good power for a front driver with the right work.

Why it matters how the price of a used WRX compared to a new SVT, I dunno...

Is a Ferrari Enzo any less of a car because a used 1982 Honda Formula 1 car costs less?

The fact of the matter is, my car currently costs a bit less *in total* than a WRX, yet is faster. It will soon be faster than an STI.

I'm left with a fast car with lower insurance than a WRX, and if I ball it up on track I can get a new chassis for $2000.

I'm sorry you've had such bad luck with your car, ours have been pretty good.

My 2000 had all the requisit recalls. But I put 60,000km on it, I think I had to change the brakes once, which is normal, and a few minor warranty repairs.

My current 2001 has been great for 60k as well. I can barely remember any warranty work... I know I had to clean the Idle Bypass Valve...

Tina's 2002 has been great. 40k on it, and only one Check Engine warranty job, and a windnoise repair.

Pretty decent. Won't be conclusive until we put more miles on, but it certainly couldn't be condemned at this point either.

 

[Peloton25]

correct me if I'm wrong but when i as at the dealer the other day, there were many Focus' over 18k.

Your not being fair here - comparing the price you can get an '02 WRX for -vs- the MSRP on the window sticker of an '03 Focus.

The MSRP on my new '03 was $16,275 and my out the door price, including tax and license, was roughly $13,300. No one is paying sticker price for a Focus these days.

>8^)
ER

 

[ZX3Rally]

"(slaps forhead). Well Jesus you're mixing new and used."

I am compairing value for the dollar, new and used makes little diffrence, the cost, and the condition is all that matters. The example i gave was an 02 WRX Vs. New Focus. Both still have warrenties, and both were in the same condition.

I would never compare my supra to my focus, My whole point is they were completely diffrent worlds. I could run the 1/4 mile, turn around and almost be back to the start line before my focus reaches the end of the 1/4.

I am not a big drag racer either, I like road coarses, and auto-x, so just going fast in a strait line means little to me as well. (To whoever mentioned that previously.)

 

[P-51]

No way on earth you can touch a Supra, even a stock TT would destroy all but the radiclly modified Foci. A BPU Supra would take them easily, drag, highway role, or most importanly, Road coarses, start talking about Single turbo Supra's and your in the 600-800 rwhp range, with 330 rubber on the back and 285 on the front.

Oh, this too...

I've passed a Supra on track too. So, yeah. I find the Supra is a big heavy beast that's hard to drive fast, but there are a few samples running big power that kids like to fap off too... The fact is, you rarely see them on track, and when you do it's usually by some poseur who can't drive.

I'd guess 80% of the cars I see on track being wrung out are little econoboxes that are cheap to run and easy to drive.

 

[seminole_kev]

Rally, do you know how that '02 WRX was treated? Why was it traded in so soon? Was is some kid who beat the hell out of it? Was it wrecked at all? These are all the questions that you have to ask when you look at a used car, even if it is only a year old. That is one of the reasons that used cars have a depreciated price.

Why not go and get a used '02 Mustang instead? Or one of the last RX7's Mazda made? Or a used Audi S4 instead? Why would someone take a "lesser" new car over a "better" used car?

 

[hatched]

I have seen stock WRX's take stock SVT's at the track, and at auto-x's. Unless that auto-x coarse is so tight the shorter wheel base comes into play, i don't find that likely.

WRXs aren't in the same class as the SVT, either (are they?). It's like comparing apples to oranges. And as someone else mentioned, The Supra isn't an economy car, and the Focus isn't a RWD sports car.

I had quite a few problems with my Focus, too. However, it wasn't the worst car I've ever owned by a longshot. I think you've come to the wrong place to dis the Focus …

 

[belacyrf]

Thanks Peloton... I was wondering if anyone else was going to point out the flaw in that line of thinking!

ZX3Rally, I personally don't feel it's fair to compare a focus to a Supra, I mean talk about apples and oranges. And heck even a WRX isnt' in the same category at a +5K price tag! And stock for stock, the SVT "power" wise would get killed by the WRX, but it can outhandle the WRX and it's heralded AWD for the most part.

I agree, the SVT and all other foci pale when compared to the likes of the SRT-4 and the Mazdaspeed Protoge (at least I like the protoge) but it was definately Top Dog when it was first released.

I've had plenty of reliability problems with my SVT as well, but my new 99 Jetta had just as many problems, but it didn't "feel" as solid as my focus does, and it cost more!!

So I dont' think it's fair to compare this car against the likes of cars that cost 5-10K more. Compare it in 2003 against it competition and the SVT comes in about 3rd or 4th depending who you talk to. Compare it to the cars that came out when it did, and the SVT is in 1st.

Now compare the zx3 against cars in it's class, and there is No Better Deal to be had with any other car. For 14K I can't see you getting any car with the power of the 2.3 with the focus chassis. I wouldn't mind some lesser powertrain issues, but I'm definately happy with the car!

 

[ZX3Rally]

P-51, your car may be faster than a WRX on a wet road coarse, for the same money, but If memory serves, you are very modified yes? Turbo? fuel system, fuel cell, supension, etc. etc. Your car is nearing the point of being a purpose built track car. Which IMHO is great. I love to see cars like yours at the track, I really really do. They are an absolute blast to run against. Can you really run faster than a modified WRX on a road coarse? or perhaps a modified EVO, or STi? If so, thats freaking goovy.

Congrats on turning a pile of crap into a good track car. I know it must of been a lot of hard work. (dude, not being a smart ass, I really mean it, that really says something.)I hope to see you at a track someday.