First your engine gets really hot, pistons start melting, head cracks, then a massive detonation sequence causes a nuclear reaction sending the exhaust cam through the firewall into your lap(sideways) cutting you in half, rendering you helpless in your burning focus!!!!

NOT-lol jk-Seriously I don't think it would make a difference...although i could be wrong

 

For the little bit of money you would save by buying a more common oil I would stay with the recommended one. With modern cars everything is designed and researched to death to run at an optimum condition. I assume yours is a 2000 model year as the 2001 takes 5W20. Maybe the question should be should you switch to 5W20? I don't think there is any physical difference between 2000 and 2001 engines. The 5W20 will improve starts and give better fuel economy.

 

Stay with whats recommended. There are disadvantages to thicker and thinner oils, and I doubt any of us are qualified or have the equipment neccesary to determine what else works well.

But I'd go with the thinner of the two they suggest. Better fuel economy, and you'll probably gain a hp.

 

Nothing, I have been using Mobil 1 10w30, since I had about 3,000 miles on my car. Runs fine to me.

 

I'm using the Mobil 10w-30 also and no probs yet. it reall won't make much of a diff.

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Dig Dug
'01 CD Silver S2

 

I don't have any documented reason why I use 10w30 synthetic other than personal reasons.

I now have 18K miles and have used 10w30 synthetic after 3K miles. I did it because it's so damn hot here in Southwest Florida and I drive 30 miles each way to work on the freeway. I also have the habit of sitting in the driveway long enough for the temp guage to begin moving...I don't haul a$$ on a cold motor.

Now I never did pretend to know everything about engines so if someone can point me towards good information why I shouldn't be doing this, I would be grateful.

Bobby

Edit part is changing "motors" to "engines"

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"01 Yellow ZX3

[This message has been edited by Bobby (edited 09-05-2001).]

 

You will get a tiny bit worse mileage and your engine will last longer because it is better protected.

Remember the Zetec and SPI engines we are currently sattled with aren't the super high tolerance engines that are actually designed for super thin oil.

When the Duratec finally arrives 5w20 or 5w30 will probably be the right choice.

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Rainforest Green ZX3 5 Speed "Kona Car"
K&N Cone Filter
Tint 51% Rear / 71% Front
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My Home Page

 

The w as in 5w or 10w means winter. Running 10w30 oil in a hot climate is certainly ok and probably preferable as it will hold up better.

 

Multi-weight oils (e.g. - 10W-30) are a new invention made possible by adding polymers to oil. The polymers allow the oil to have different weights at different temperatures. The first number indicates the viscocity of the oil at a cold temperature, while the second number indicates the viscosity at operating temperature. At cold temperatures the polymers are coiled up and allow the oil to flow as their low numbers indicate. As the oil warms up the polymers begin to unwind into long chains that prevent the oil from thinning as much as it normally would. The result is that at 100 degrees C the oil has thinned only as much as the higher viscosity number indicates. Another way of looking at multi-vis oils is to think of a 20W-50 as a 20 weight oil that will not thin more than a 50 weight would when hot.

 

I think thats a quote from one of those articles WRCfan posted. Another important note from that article is that you should use the NARROWEST viscosity range you can get away with, since the polymers can shear and burn leaving nasty deposits. "Fewer polymers are better for all engines" is a direct quote I believe.

So for the winter, you would base it off the coldest temp your car should expect to see, and base it off that. For the summer do the opposite and base it on the highest temp and go down from there. To answer the question in the title then, I'd use the narrower 5W-20 range (and not 5W-30 if thats an option) for that specific reason.

And not only is there that advantage, but you can see a lot of benifits with regard to mileage and a slight increase in hp by using a thinner weight oil (but a good synthetic like Mobil 1 so it isn't as prone to breaking down). Just don't try and totally rethink the manufacturers recomendations, as an oil with too high a viscosity might not pump properly to certain parts of the engine and with too low a viscosity the oil film could tear at high rpm.

Even though its pretty warm down here, I'm going with 5W-20 in my next oil change.

 

Guys, this morning at work, Ford sent us a video on recommended oil for ALL Ford vehicles. it was really early in the morning, and I wasnt really paying attention until they talked about the Focus. Now, the main thing I remember from the video is that you should NOT use anything other than 5W-20 because this specific oil(doesnt matter what brand) is made with a special additive. Dont remember exactly, but i know, that you will NOT see any immediate problems, but in the longer run, you most deffinately will. Ford engineers were in the video explaining the importance of going with the recommended oil. Thankfully, i've always used 5W-20, but some of you out there havent. The Focus motor, SPI or Zetec was designed to specifically run on this oil. You really shouldnt be running anything else but 5W-20. It will cause long-term damage to main bearings, rod bearings, etc., etc.

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'01 Yellow ZX3
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-Custom 2 1/4 exhaust with HP Racing muffler
-NOS(60-shot)
-MILDLY ported & polished head
-Esslinger UDP
-K&N cone filter
- H&R springs
-retarded timing
-colder plugs
-fog light mod
-Black A** Tints
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Best Run:
14.6 @ 93

 

I guess my question is then this:

Does using a synthetic oil compensate? ie. by running 5w30 Amsoil synthetic, am I still better off then running 5w20 dino oil?
Damn, screw this debate

I'm just going to go with the recommended weight and switch over to 5w20 synthetic on my next change in 4 months (just got one done last week). Then I can avoid the debate altogether and just defer all contrary opinions to my friendly neighbourhood Ford Zetec engineer, lol...

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2001 Twilight Blue ZTS <UL TYPE=SQUARE> <LI> KW Sport Kit, MBRP cat-back exhaust, FocusSport street header, FocusSport UDP, ZX3tuning shorty antenna, Euro Focus locking fuel door.[/list]

 

Well I really liked this analogy:

Dino oil is like having a bunch of guys from the general population in your little army. Some guys are fat or thin, some are muscular or skinny, etc... If your fat and wimpy guys crap out first, you need to replace the whole army. Thats why you should change the oil at the short intervals listed by Ford (they assume the use of dino juice).

Sythetic is like having an army of clones. Everybody is 6 foot tall and muscular. The quality of the synthetic will determine how good all your clones are (even if they are identical). They should all fail uniformly. We are the borg... resistance is futile.

With regard to 5W-20 being the ONLY one with a certain aditive... how can they say that??? All the different manufacturers have their OWN additive packages, and I highly doubt that they are all identical in their composition. Each brand has a unique blend of... actually let me quote "base and stock viscosity improvers, pour point depresents, detergents, dispersants, foam depresants, oxidation corrosion and rust inhibitors, anti-wear agents..." All the major oil brands in the proper viscosites (listed differently for the two years even though we know no changes were made to the engines) will meet the Ford's warranty requirements. Ford said in 2000 to use X-viscosity oil, and any oil manf. that meets Ford's requirements in the viscosity range can be used.

Here is another nice pro-synthetic quote btw: "The synthetics offer the only truly significant differences, due to their superior high temperature oxidation resistance, high film strength, very low tendency to form deposits, stable viscosity base, and low temperature flow characteristics. Synthetics are superior lubricants compared to traditional petroleum oils. You will have to decide if their high cost is justified in your application."

If you consider all the advantages of a quality synthetic with regard to protection during starts and at high temps, and combine that with being able to go two or three times as long when combined with a quality oil filter... it just makes sense. With conditions like they are here (stop and go traffic in hot weather), I'd be changing oil every 3K miles if I didn't use synthetic. Synthetic lets me stretch it to 6K miles w/o problems, so you have to factor in that cost. Plus, I'm lazy and servicing the Zetec engine is a PITA.

[This message has been edited by Ducman69 (edited 09-06-2001).]

 

Bottlefed: If all this is true about the zetec being designed to run on 5w20 then tell me why Ford recommends 5w30 for most pre 2001 cars and trucks. This includes the 2000 Focus not to mention the 99 2.0s over in europe which have the same zetec as a 2001. Pre-2001 ZX2s, Cougars, Contours, etc. - same engine but recommended to use 5w30. Not trying to hassle you or anything - its just a load of crap. They suggest 5w20 for better fuel economy - nothing more, nothing less.

[This message has been edited by Turtle (edited 09-06-2001).]

 

It is quite amazing how all the Ford engines that existed in model year '00 and earlier that are still used in the '01+ model year are now suddenly designed to use 5W20 oil. Yeah right! Sounds like they were showing you a propaganda film BottleFed.

I think what happened is that Ford's supplier of oil fill caps misprinted the label, so Ford said ah, heck let's just make a new blend of oil and play it off as the best thing since sliced bread.

 

Here's a related question,

I recall some time ago a post saying that certian types of synthetic oils are better than than others.

Saying that type "x" (they called it something else) like Mobil 1 or Redline was good but that type "y" like Castrol Syntec was bad.

I will probably switch from dino oil to synthetic at my 7500 mi oil change and, being a Castrol guy just assumed I would be using Syntec. I would like to know if there was a reason to go with Mobil 1.

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Rainforest Green ZX3 5 Speed "Kona Car"
K&N Cone Filter
Tint 51% Rear / 71% Front
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My Home Page

 

I don't have a good answer. If you asked me what the composition of Mobil 1 was compared to some other brand... I couldn't tell you.

What I CAN tell you, is that it has a fantastic reputation in the oil community as an "off the shelf" sythetic. Amsoil, Mobil 1, and Redline have a top notch reputation in most of the articles I've read.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>It is also important to note that, contrary to what many take for granted, higher viscosity in and of itself does not translate into better engine protection. Extensive testing has shown the opposite to be infact true. As long as a lower-viscosity oil is formulated to resist evaporation and provide high film strength, this lighter oil will actually deliver more complete protection to the engine parts, since its more rapid circulation delivers both better lubrication per se, and far
better cooling characteristics...a critical advantage, given that oil flow furnishes up to 30% of an engine cooling requirements. Prior to the introduction of synthetics, however, the problem of evaporation (and
the resultant thickening of the remaining oil) was addressed primarily by increasing viscosity. In short, don't be concerned with the relatively lower viscosity ratings of some synthetics. Syn lubes are a whole new ball game.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
There is another response to that original question. I've been reading through several articles, and its rather time consuming, so I just try to pick out the highlights.

Relating to break-in period, this same article also notes:
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Second, most engine and lubricant manufacturers recommend that synthetic oil not be used during the "break-in" period of an engine. The reason for this is that synthetics, possessing extraordinary lubricity and lubricant film strength, do not permit the metal wear necessary for the
seating of piston rings. A change to synthetic motor oil should wait until you new or rebuilt engine has completed the break-in period of six to eight thousand miles.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

And the question about mixing synthetics and dino oils being a problem... it is NOT. Only the very first synthetics (remember they are popular now but have been around for a long time) were a Polyalkylene Glycol which could not be mixed with dino juice or it would gel. However, All common syntetics used for engine lubrication now days are a Polyalphaolefin (Mobil 1) or a Dibasic Organic Ester type (Redline). These are fully compatable with conventional oils. In fact Golden Spectro and AGIP Sint 2000 are mixtures of mineral and synthetic oils.

Golden Spectro (what I use) is actually very popular with the motorcycle crowd using wet clutches, since the synthetics can be TOO slippery and not allow your bike's clutch to engage properly.

I'll try to share and condense information as I learn more. Its hard weeding out those articles that seem incomplete or are influenced by the different manufacturers themselves.

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00 Ford ZX3/ 96 Ford Cobra
90 Yam FJ1200/ 85 Yam RZ350 / 84 Yam RZ350
Engine Forum Moderator -Chris-

[This message has been edited by Ducman69 (edited 09-06-2001).]

[This message has been edited by Ducman69 (edited 09-07-2001).]

 

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by raitchison:
When the Duratec finally arrives 5w20 or 5w30 will probably be the right choice.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

The duratec is actually the exact same engine, they are just re-naming it.

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Dig Dug
'01 CD Silver S2

 

Im not trying to be a smart guy, but the "W" stands for Weight not Winter. Oil is a thixotropic compound. This means that it oil wont go to a gel state sitting but it will thin as it is heated or stirred. No engine requires a dual viscosity oil, it just works better when environments change from hot to cold. Hope this helps everyone out. <BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by lt7d101:
The w as in 5w or 10w means winter. Running 10w30 oil in a hot climate is certainly ok and probably preferable as it will hold up better.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

 

No, he was right. The W means that the oil meets the minimum viscosity requirements at zero degrees farenheit, and therefore is safe for winter use. So the 'W' stands for winter. They don't put it on the upper number, because its redundant and thats the upper viscosity range when its hot anyway.

And the Duratec is not the same engine. Its much more fuel efficient, looks completely different if you've seen a pic, and produces slightly more hp stock (140 I believe). They are using it in the Mondeo in Europe right now.

[This message has been edited by Ducman69 (edited 09-06-2001).]

 

I was corrected via email that Redline is actually the only non-military spec motor oil available to the public that is an Ester base.

Now honestly, I only know so far that pure PAOs have caused problems due to pure PAO base shrinking gaskets and causing leaks. So we have PAO/Ester blends. With Redline as the only pure ester base. Not sure what the advantages of a pure ester are and why everyone doesn't use that then. Apparently jet turbine oils are also pure ester base.

Of course, I had to find out more. Taking your info from few sources is a problem.

I did stumble upon this though. First they praised Mobil 1 as the BEST oil that is readily available. Following this, they proceeded with the statement:
Castrol Syntec/Magnatec
Not a Synthetic PAO/Ester based oil, it is a Group-III mineral oil "chemically pseudo-synthetised" hydrocracking to convert wax impurities (very undesired re sludge) into longer-chained oils without loss of volume thereby maximising profit per raw barrel of material. Owners of Audi, BMW, Porsche & Mazdas have reported black gloops of wax deposits coming out during oil drains which are not good for drain-pan screens or HLAs. Ash content is 1.2%, higher than any of the PAO/Ester based synthetics (<0.5%) and higher even than plain Castrol GTX at 0.7%. Ash forms deposits on valves and sludge, as HLAs will indicate. There are better oils on the market than this, for the same price or cheaper. Unfortunately Mobil taking Castrol to an advertising tribunal merely had the effect of allowing just about anything to be classed as "synthetic" when it's not a Group-IV/V PAO/Ester base. Does that answer your question Ratchison?

It sounds like for those that don't want to do additional research, just stick with Mobil.

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>To summarize:

Stick with the thinner stuff in synthetic for fuel economy, don't use fram oil filters, wait 6-8K miles before switching to synthetic for the first time, and avoid castrol syntec (and perhaps look into Mobil or Redline as reputable manuf.).<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Thoughts?

I know I've learned a hell of a lot.

[This message has been edited by Ducman69 (edited 09-07-2001).]

 

wow

i'm at 20k miles and i'm still using dino and i just did my oil change

maybe when i do it again in the next 4300 miles i'll change to redline synthetic

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2000 ZX3 Kona edt. 5spd.
Performance mods:
esslinger adj. Cam gears
esslinger udp
K&N drop in filter
B&M Short throw shifter
Vibrant cat back (still waiting)

 

Castrol is not a true synthetic by definition.
All the blended mixes are no better than dino oil.I currently am running Mobil 1 in my 2001 Focus. Maybe a slight drop in MPG but tough to tell because of heavy ac use.I really find it hard to beleive that Ford would make any changes in between model years that would require the 5-20 weight.Tighter tolerances not likely.Different bearings, oil pump I doubt it.Being a big SUV Corporation they are probably just boosting there CAFE rating to sell more sport utes.

 

Ducman69...thanks for doing all the research. And yes, you can teach an old dog new tricks.

I've been using Castrol forever; partly because it's what my chief mechanic used in our first race car and partly because John Force does (the power of marketing

).

Well....I was going to the beach this afternoon and have a couple of cold ones. Looks like I'll be doing an oil change instead

Good information coming out of this thread!

Bobby

 

My "2000 Ford Focus Owner's Manual" says to use 5w-30, so thats what i use.